England and Russia could be thrown out of Euro 2016

[mistermack]

You really believe the british voter to be that dumb? the football euro and the EU are completely unrelated.

They've voted for Cameron twice. They're capable of anything.

It's all down to the turnout. Will the weak Brexit voters like me bother to vote, in the end, or just stay at home?
They don't know who to believe, me included, so it just depends on how they feel on the day.
Getting kicked out of European football might just motivate enough of them to actually make the effort, if it's super-tight.

[JimC]

A bit like the US presidential election, it may well come down to what percentage of potential supporters of each side bother to vote...

[pErvinalia]

You really believe the british voter to be that dumb? the football euro and the EU are completely unrelated.

They've voted for Cameron twice. They're capable of anything.

Like climate change denial.

[Scot Dutchy]

You really believe the british voter to be that dumb? the football euro and the EU are completely unrelated.

They've voted for Cameron twice. They're capable of anything.

It's all down to the turnout. Will the weak Brexit voters like me bother to vote, in the end, or just stay at home?
They don't know who to believe, me included, so it just depends on how they feel on the day.
Getting kicked out of European football might just motivate enough of them to actually make the effort, if it's super-tight.

Yes for a great number the importance of this vote is not apparent in fact it is a complete unknown. Ignorance will be definitely be present.

The constant Brexit lies and myths supported by the Sum and Wail we be followed to the letter. Renegotiations to get back in will be non existent so welcome to the desert of international isolation and join countries such as Turkey and Armenia.

We will not suffer as will the rest of the Eurozone (dont believe what you read in the Wail we dont need you). So goodbye as you set to go over the edge. We can finally move on.

[mistermack]

so welcome to the desert of international isolation and join countries such as Turkey and Armenia.

And China and the USA and Canada and Australia and Japan and South Korea and Singapore and New Zealand.
How they must be all suffering, not being in Europe.
It must be hell.

Oh, and poor India. Struggling along with their ox carts and sacred cows.

[Scot Dutchy]

so welcome to the desert of international isolation and join countries such as Turkey and Armenia.

And China and the USA and Canada and Australia and Japan and South Korea and Singapore and New Zealand.
How they must be all suffering, not being in Europe.
It must be hell.

Oh, and poor India. Struggling along with their ox carts and sacred cows.

You dont understand do you. They have all trade agreements with each other. Do you really think they are going to bother making favourable agreements with the British? Keep on dreaming when reality wakes you up you will be screaming to get back into the EU but I am afraid the door will be closed. By then of course only Little England will be left.

[pErvinalia]

Why wouldn't the rest of us make trade deals with the British?

We'll make trade deals. The negative for Britain will be that they will be negotiating from a position of relative weakness compared to when they negotiate as part of the EU bloc.

[Scot Dutchy]

Why wouldn't the rest of us make trade deals with the British?

We'll make trade deals. The negative for Britain will be that they will be negotiating from a position of relative weakness compared to when they negotiate as part of the EU bloc.

Exactly the point I am making. Try and negotiate from a position of weakness you wont get any good agreements. Britain's trade is only contains 10% of manufacturing output. 45% of its trade is with the EU which a large part is services. Well who in the EU will use those services with high tariff barriers?
Frankfurt is more than willing to take the City of London's place.



Yes the rest of the world is waiting for Britain and I dont think.

Here is good balanced article from the LSE:

http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexitvote/2016/ ... eferendum/

It is not propaganda but cold facts something which the Brexiters are terrified to look at.

http://video.ft.com/4854069744001/Marti ... ears/World

[Scot Dutchy]

Just wanted to show a few points from that article for those who cant be bothered reading it:

The losses will not fall evenly, but on particular regions (e.g. Cornwall), particular sectors (farming), on particular parts of the country (e.g. where foreign-owned car plants are sited), and on tax-financed public services such as the NHS if lower growth adds to fiscal pressures.
...........................

The argument that the UK will be able to negotiate good trade deals quickly is implausible.

The EU is more important to the UK than vice versa, so our bargaining power is limited.
Brexit risks a chain reaction, given rising nationalism across the EU (on which more below). Thus the EU’s rational response is to make a horrible example of the UK.
For non-EU countries (e.g. USA, China), negotiating with the EU offers access to a market of 500 million. The UK is much less of a magnet.
................................

‘The claim that the outcome will be fine because Britain is the fifth-largest economy in the world is technically wrong, a non sequitur and a fundamental misreading of history. It is hard to think of a worse argument’ (Chris Giles, Economics Editor, Financial Times, 4 May 2016).
................................
(The 350million a week claim that Britain pays to the EU)

In everyday terms, the cost of EU membership is less than 30p per person per day, roughly the cost of a cheap mobile phone contract. The reduction in the government’s tax revenues from even a small reduction in growth rates after leaving would dwarf any saving in our net EU contribution.

That is just the economic side. This is why this referendum like so many referenda is stupid because the facts are so complicated. How in the hell is John Smith going to understand it when idiots like Farage et al cant.

[pErvinalia]

Just wanted to show a few points from that article for those who cant be bothered reading it:

I love it when someone knows me this well!

[Scot Dutchy]

[mistermack]

Only one problem with all of these theories. They are bollocks.

If the EU wants to trade with Britain, they will need a deal. It works both ways.
And you only have to look at British roads to see that they will DEFINITELY want a deal.

It's perfectly obvious that the starting point will have to be the current deal.
Anything worse will bring damaging retaliation from both sides.

Britain can buy it's cars from Japan, the US, South Korea and Malasia etc etc.
Or increase home production.

Where is Germany going to sell all the Mercs and VWs and BMs, and France all the Renaults and Citroens that it will have left over?

There is an awful lot of simplistic bollocks being spewed out by the remain side.

[rainbow]

Britain can buy it's cars from Japan, the US, South Korea and Malasia etc etc.
Or increase home production.

Yes, absolutely.

Get these back into production.

[Scot Dutchy]

Only one problem with all of these theories. They are bollocks.

If the EU wants to trade with Britain, they will need a deal. It works both ways.
And you only have to look at British roads to see that they will DEFINITELY want a deal.

It's perfectly obvious that the starting point will have to be the current deal.
Anything worse will bring damaging retaliation from both sides.

Britain can buy it's cars from Japan, the US, South Korea and Malasia etc etc.
Or increase home production.

Where is Germany going to sell all the Mercs and VWs and BMs, and France all the Renaults and Citroens that it will have left over?

There is an awful lot of simplistic bollocks being spewed out by the remain side.

That is bollocks. 45% of British trade is with Europe. What trade is that precise? Not much manufacturing that is for sure. Mostly services. Services that the EU will not need as we can get them cheaper within the EU.

How would Britain retaliate? Not buying German and French cars. Those car companies will get over it and they are not the only goods that the EU produces but yet again the Brexit myths are for you impossible to forget. Britain is only 15% of the EU population remember.

What is the present deal btw? There is none and one has to be negotiated during the two year divorce as laid down in the Treaty of Maastricht.

Do really think the rest of the world is wanting to trade with Britain? Do you think the countries of the Pacific basin are dying to do deals with Britain? The NAFTA countries are dying to deals with Britain? Britain will be forced by America to accept a very one sided version of the TTIP in order for Britain to trade with it. Good luck with that one. British farmers can forget Europe if that happens.

There are a enormous amount of myths and lies being spewed out by the Brexit camp. Learn the real facts before destroying your country.

[pErvinalia]

I doubt it's going to be as drastic as you paint it. Where's the benefit to the US, Europe and others of an impoverished Britain? Sure, they'll push them hard to get a favourable deal, and they will definitely get concessions. But the US et al has no interest in not trading with the UK.