They are 'shutting' Pirate Bay. Good or Bad?

[Clinton Huxley]

If you walk into a bookshop and walk out again with a copy of The DaVinci Code without paying, it's theft. Same if you download a film from a torrent site. You've stolen it. Just because you can download it for nothing doesn't make it legal.

I fancy a new telly, I'm off to Comet to steal one....

[Atheist-Lite]

The answer is to make a example of people by really blowing some peoples lives out of the water with massive fines and prison.

[Animavore]

If you borrow a copy of The DaVinci code from the library or a friend it's not theft. If you borrow a film from an anonymous friend it's hard to see it as theft. You just want to look at it. Not own it.

[Clinton Huxley]

If you borrow a copy of The DaVinci code from the library or a friend it's not theft. If you borrow a film from an anonymous friend it's hard to see it as theft. You just want to look at it. Not own it.

Ok, you are just "borrowing" the films. Good luck with that defence in court.

I'm off to borrow a tv from Comet....

[Animavore]

It won't go to court. I'm highlighting the problem. Nothing ever happens. No one sees it as theft. When has anyone ever been made to feel criminal for having a drawer full of 90 minute audio cassettes of recorded albums? Who do you know who's ever been arrested for illegal copying? No one.

[Mallardz]

I don't download anything.
I do stream a lot of films since being at University though. Largely indifferent in regards to pirate bay considering.

[Clinton Huxley]

It won't go to court. I'm highlighting the problem. Nothing ever happens. No one sees it as theft. When has anyone ever been made to feel criminal for having a drawer full of 90 minute audio cassettes of recorded albums? Who do you know who's ever been arrested for illegal copying? No one.

Aye, it's tricky to enforce. But then lots of crimes are difficult to prosecute. Doesn't mean you shouldn't try.

[Rum]

The responses show how slippery the issue is, however like it or not, whether you think the entertainment industry are a bunch of greedy twats, most of what people do if they download stuff that is copyright one way or another is actually depriving them of a planned profit stream. It is theft more or less.

I'm not moralising - I have been guilty of it myself with music, justifying it by saying I only get stuff I wouldn't pay for. To some extent that is true as my favourite music is purchased, however that isn't really a defense either in the end.

[Clinton Huxley]

The industry should be smarter about this, though. Maybe they could release their own legal torrents, with embedded advertising or something. Similar to apps, you can get the app with advertising for northing or you can get an ad-free version if you pay.

[Animavore]

It won't go to court. I'm highlighting the problem. Nothing ever happens. No one sees it as theft. When has anyone ever been made to feel criminal for having a drawer full of 90 minute audio cassettes of recorded albums? Who do you know who's ever been arrested for illegal copying? No one.

Aye, it's tricky to enforce. But then lots of crimes are difficult to prosecute. Doesn't mean you shouldn't try.

But how do you change people's views? When I was a child my granddad and uncles and friend's dads had tons of recorded audio cassettes. They also had lots of bought vinyl. I was surprised to read on the back of an album one day that copying was "prohibited". Is everyone doing something illegal I wondered. But no one was caring. No one was being shamed or shunned like drug dealers and other "real" criminals. I'd never heard of anyone walking into someone else's house and upon seeing a drawer full of cassettes saying, "Oh my god! I'm calling the police. Kids, we're leaving." No one does that. When do you ever hear scandalous gossip that such and such is downloading films? Everyone has a "so what?" attitude to piracy. They roll their eyes and fast forward the video piracy trailers or just laugh if the DVD is a pirate copy. What's to be done?

[Svartalf]

If you walk into a bookshop and walk out again with a copy of The DaVinci Code without paying, it's theft. Same if you download a film from a torrent site. You've stolen it. Just because you can download it for nothing doesn't make it legal.

I fancy a new telly, I'm off to Comet to steal one....

If you download a copy of a work you'd never buy or otherwise acquire in a paying manner (no buying the book, no renting dvds or going to see it in theatres no nothing), then there is no loss and it's a victimless action.
Theft of physical goods is a different matter entirely, as those have an actual cost.
OTOH, I've sufficiently liked some of the stuff I've seen in pirated version that I ended up buying the DVD.

[Clinton Huxley]

It won't go to court. I'm highlighting the problem. Nothing ever happens. No one sees it as theft. When has anyone ever been made to feel criminal for having a drawer full of 90 minute audio cassettes of recorded albums? Who do you know who's ever been arrested for illegal copying? No one.

Aye, it's tricky to enforce. But then lots of crimes are difficult to prosecute. Doesn't mean you shouldn't try.

But how do you change people's views? When I was a child my granddad and uncles and friend's dads had tons of recorded audio cassettes. They also had lots of bought vinyl. I was surprised to read on the back of an album one day that copying was "prohibited". Is everyone doing something illegal I wondered. But no one was caring. No one was being shamed or shunned like drug dealers and other "real" criminals. I'd never heard of anyone walking into someone else's house and upon seeing a drawer full of cassettes saying, "Oh my god! I'm calling the police. Kids, we're leaving." No one does that. When do you ever hear scandalous gossip that such and such is downloading films? Everyone has a "so what?" attitude to piracy. They roll their eyes and fast forward the video piracy trailers or just aught if the DVD is a pirate copy. What's to be done?

I guess it will only start to be perceived as a crime when more people get very visibly prosecuted for it. You are attempting to change a mindset that has been there, as you say, since the C60 was invented. People will always try to get something for nothing if they can. I bet most shoplifters never get caught but that's not a reason to just shrug and not prosecute.

[Clinton Huxley]

If you walk into a bookshop and walk out again with a copy of The DaVinci Code without paying, it's theft. Same if you download a film from a torrent site. You've stolen it. Just because you can download it for nothing doesn't make it legal.

I fancy a new telly, I'm off to Comet to steal one....

If you download a copy of a work you'd never buy or otherwise acquire in a paying manner (no buying the book, no renting dvds or going to see it in theatres no nothing), then there is no loss and it's a victimless action.
Theft of physical goods is a different matter entirely, as those have an actual cost.
OTOH, I've sufficiently liked some of the stuff I've seen in pirated version that I ended up buying the DVD.

I don't think the distinction between physical and electronic goodsd holds. And you could always say, "Well. I never would have bought it, so you've lost no money". I could use that defence to steal some Frangelica from the off-licence, "Well, i would never pay for Frangelica, so you haven't lost anything..."

[Animavore]

But, y'know, another point too. Films like The Life of Brian and The Exorcist which were banned in Ireland by stupid censorship laws could only be obtained as pirate copies. My dad has The Life of Brian on audio cassette narrated by John Cleese. Where do you stand on the issue in these cases were things are unjustly censored?

[Clinton Huxley]

But, y'know, another point too. Films like The Life of Brian and The Exorcist which were banned in Ireland by stupid censorship laws could only be obtained as pirate copies. My dad has The Life of Brian on audio cassette narrated by John Cleese. Where do you stand on the issue in these cases were things are unjustly censored?

That is an interesting point. I'm not sure of a way round it but maybe in Europe, at least, an "anti-censorship" clause could be written into the law and that would be a possible defence in court.