Hurricane Harvey

[Forty Two]

I wonder what would happen to the Netherlands if it got hit by a CAT 4 dropping 1.3 meters of water in a few days....

Nothing. We would have defences in place if we were living in a hurricane zone. We plan and build for the 1 in 10,000 year event not the 1 in 100 year.

The point is that you don't live in a hurricane zone, and the hurricane zones in the US are not the same - specifically Houston and the vicinity. The same things the Dutch do will not be the solution for Houston. Some of what the Dutch do is great for New Orleans, which is why the US takes seriously the Dutch proposals for helping further prepare New Orleans for the future.

A hurricane risk is, of course, far different from the risks the Netherlands faces, which is primarily a result of it being low-lying, and below sea level. Can folks not see that this is different than living in a place which faces an occasional risk of a massive storm? And, can't folks see that building polders and dikes is not going to put a huge dent in what happened in Houston. Getting hit by a hurricane is more like getting hit by a bomb. There's only so much you can do.

Houston is a city that covers 600 square miles and is above sea level. It is not storm surge or flooding from the ocean that's the problem. The Houston flooding was a result of about 10 trillion gallons of water falling in three days, and the rain total over less than a week was like 5 feet -- about a meter and a half.

There is obviously stuff that can be done. But, please, stop it with the "just do what the Dutch do" or point to some other region and exclaim that the silly Americans just can't handle it. This is not the same situation as what other countries have faced. And, the Netherlands is a blip on the map. If it got hit with Hurricane Harvey, it would have suffered massive damage too. And, to sit here and say that the Dutch are so awesome they would have known to build whatever needed to be built so nothing would have happened. That's just stupid conceit.

[Brian Peacock]

The ideological arguments over who should do what, how, and when, become insignificant before the elephant in the room. Climate change is having, and is going to have increasingly profound effects on society, social order, resource allocation and government, regardless of the political perspectives of those in power - and there's no denying that.

[Forty Two]

Well, and there is some mythology afoot that the United States is a libertarian country where the government doesn't engage in large projects, or would not be involved in the large projects, and that the United States is not working on projects to address sea level, flooding and hurricane issues.

[Scot Dutchy]

Oh the myth: If America cant do it nobody can. But there you go. A country that has made a complete mess of itself at every level of society and in every place claims if we cant do it then nobody can.

When is America going to close prisons, get a universal health care system or even the simplest of good education for all its people. Never because so very few see the big picture. How many Americans have a passport? How many Americans know their own country.

[Sean Hayden]

[Sean Hayden]

Scot Dutchy be like:

[Forty Two]

Oh the myth: If America cant do it nobody can.

I never said that. You're the one touting the Dutchland Uber Alles. All I said was that what you do in the Netherregions to stick your finger in the dike is not necessarily of much help to address the situation of large hurricanes dropping 10 trillion gallons of water on a 1000 sq. km area. And, the suggestion that the US is not doing anything about these situations is simply wrong.

But there you go. A country that has made a complete mess of itself at every level of society and in every place claims if we cant do it then nobody can.

Not in the least. You'll recall above where I said that the US has taken seriously various Dutch-sourced proposals for bolstering and protecting New Orleans. Nobody has made the assertion that if the US can't do it, nobody can.

But, the idea that the US has made a complete mess of itself at every level of society is absurd. It's just pig-ignorance.

When is America going to close prisons,

Good question. Probably when we end the war on drugs.

get a universal health care system

We have one. Everyone is by law required to be insured, and everyone has access to health care. I agree with you that the system is less than desirable, but it's there. The fact that some people are still uninsured (a) does not prevent them from getting health care, and (b) is their own fault since if they can't afford it, they can get subsidized insurance.

or even the simplest of good education for all its people. Never because so very few see the big picture. How many Americans have a passport? How many Americans know their own country.

Americans are less likely to have passports because (a) they aren't required to have them and traditionally did not need them to travel to its neighbors, and (b) we aren't driving distance to most other countries, and the country is huge so there are plenty of places for people to go on holiday within the country.

How many Americans know their own country? Probably about the same as folks from other countries know there's. I'll give it to you that a country as tiny as the Netherlands is easier for its people to know about. You can jog across the country, for the most part, so it's easy.

The American systems are under far more scrutiny than pretty much any other countries' systems. The education system in the US is varied, but in general we are educated as well or better than most other countries. Sure, most Americans are stupid, but then again, most PEOPLE are stupid, including most Dutch. I know the conceit and famed arrogance of the Dutch causes them not to be able to acknowledge their own ignorance, of course....

[Forty Two]

[Hermit]

I watched for two minutes. How much longer till the report on Hurricane Harvey comes up? I want to skip straight to it. This thread is about Hurricane Harvey, right, so...

[Forty Two]

Well, talk to Scot Dutchy. He started down this road.

[Hermit]

Well, talk to Scot Dutchy. He started down this road.

Huh?

*Scrolls up*

Oh. I didn't click on that. Thought it was going to be another clip making fun of the "alt-left", which, as you know, doesn't even exist.

[JimC]

Forty Two wrote:

...infrastructure needed to fend off Category 4 Hurricanes...

That is a rather absurd overstatement; nothing can "fend off" a hurricane. All people were talking about was a better planned system of flood amelioration, which would at least reduce the bad effects of the flooding which comes after one of your hurricanes. And Trump has just rescinded the process which at least attempted to do that, purely because it was initiated by Obama.

[Animavore]

Forty Two wrote:

...infrastructure needed to fend off Category 4 Hurricanes...

That is a rather absurd overstatement; nothing can "fend off" a hurricane. All people were talking about was a better planned system of flood amelioration, which would at least reduce the bad effects of the flooding which comes after one of your hurricanes. And Trump has just rescinded the process which at least attempted to do that, purely because it was initiated by Obama.

Not only that, but the Repubs actually discussed diverting a billion in relief funds to Trump's idiotic wall just a couple of weeks ago.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.vanityf ... s-wall/amp

These people are shameless, unrepentant, incurably stupid, shortsighted arseholes.

[Scot Dutchy]

Once again 42 talks bollocks. Really serious bollocks. He does not even know his country. Just look at the OECD data. All that Trump does is make it even worse.

[laklak]

Meh, we manage. Since 2004 major storms that have hit Florida are : Charley, Ivan, Francis, Jeanne, Dennis, Wilma, Matthew. There were a total of 74 named storms in the same time period that had an economic impact on the state. We know more about fucking hurricanes than all y'all Euro Weenies put together. Last big storm to hit you that I can find was Storm Egon, who had a top speed biggest ever record breaking wind of 101 mph (on top of a mountain). Kicked y'alls asses, there was even a train in France that had to stay on the tracks overnight because there was a TREE on the tracks! Fucking lol. We don't get out of bed till it hits 100 sustained winds and a 10 foot storm surge.

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.