Rape

[pErvinalia]

Since, when a woman reports rape, it is generally assumed she is telling the truth, that means a lot of cases where men are charged with rape who are, in fact, innocent.

you've just done it again. Where is your evidence for this?

[Blind groper]

http://falserapesociety.blogspot.co.nz/ ... ested.html

REvo

There is nothing new about false rape complaints. The article in the reference above discusses them, including examples where the rape complainant has been shown to have been lying. Such examples are easily extracted from the internet, and there are plenty of them.

It is much more difficult if the rape complaint is based on false memory, and is sincere in her complaint. We will never know how many men get imprisoned wrongly in such cases, but there will be quite a few.

[pErvinalia]

No one denies that false claims are made. The problem is where you assert that the legal system all of a sudden behaves totally differently in rape cases to other cases. You have no evidence for this other than 'a feeling'

[Blind groper]

Wikipedia has a section on the history of rape. It discusses the way attitudes to rape have changed, including a major swing towards the female point of view. I have no problem with women being treated with more sympathy, but it concerns me that the grand old principle of innocent till proven guilty beyond reasonable doubt is suffering.

[mistermack]

I agree. Particularly since rape/not rape can come down to whether someone really meant it, when they said no.

I've both raped, and been raped, if no really means no. I can assure you that neither was in the slightest bit anywhere near rape.

But in court, they could well have been.

[rainbow]

It seems to be only a problem that cisgender heterosexual males find hard to understand.

Imagine if a straight man were to wake up next to another not very attractive male and had a sore butt.
Would you call this rape?

[piscator]

[pErvinalia]

[mistermack]

It seems to be only a problem that cisgender heterosexual males find hard to understand.

Imagine if a straight man were to wake up next to another not very attractive male and had a sore butt.
Would you call this rape?

Funny enough, that's never happened to me. Nor have any of my friends mentioned anything like it happening to them.
So maybe real rape isn't as common as people say. But what the fuck is a not very attractive male? They're all not very attractive if you're straight. And even if he was attractive, I'd want my arse checked out for dna.
I don't think I'd wait thinking about it for thirty years.

[rainbow]

It seems to be only a problem that cisgender heterosexual males find hard to understand.

Imagine if a straight man were to wake up next to another not very attractive male and had a sore butt.
Would you call this rape?

Funny enough, that's never happened to me. Nor have any of my friends mentioned anything like it happening to them.
So maybe real rape isn't as common as people say. But what the fuck is a not very attractive male? They're all not very attractive if you're straight. And even if he was attractive, I'd want my arse checked out for dna.
I don't think I'd wait thinking about it for thirty years.

...so there you are, some men are uncomfortable about talking about being buggered.

[Svartalf]

It seems to be only a problem that cisgender heterosexual males find hard to understand.

Imagine if a straight man were to wake up next to another not very attractive male and had a sore butt.
Would you call this rape?

Most definitely, I'm pure hetero

[Brian Peacock]

Do you think reporting rates and conviction rates for sexual offences are relevant here? In the UK victims of sexual abuse/assault generally opt for silence over reporting (only around 15% of those who experience sexual violence report it to the police), and the last round of home office statistics showed a proportional fall in conviction rates for the most serious sexual offences while overall reporting and conviction rates were up numerically.

http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationa ... gmarch2015

[Rum]

There's been a lot of flip flopping over this issue amongst the police, the lawyers and people like social workers who investigate in particular sexual offences against children.

When I first started out in social work in the late 70s child sexual abuse was considered rare. Freud (amongst others - part of the training back then) suggested sexual fantasy was common in children and that reported cases of child abuse were actually relatively unusual and mostly fantasy. Consequently children complaining were often dismissed - and of course this suited the abuser - often a family member. Around 1980 there were a few very high profile cases and a couple of deaths which led to a sea change in how these issues were handled. Part of those changes were an insistence that the 'child should always be believed'. This in turn eventually affected how adult rape was dealt with.

Such an approach is a very blunt instrument of course, but it has its merits when so many children were not believed or too afraid to come forward in the past.The fact is of course that sometimes people do make up stories. The facts is also that rape as well as childhood sexual abuse is very likely to be hugely under-reported as Brian points out. This thread has got it arse backwards for the most part.

[Blind groper]

http://www.skeptic.com/reading_room/the ... ning-rape/

I found my original reference on another web site, shown above.

To Brian.

Applying a little personal logic makes me think that the old business of most rapes never being reported may not be as true as we think. If Dr. Carol Tavris in the reference above is correct, and the true rate of rape is no more than 3% of women, but the widespread and incorrect belief is that around 20% get raped, then the discrepancy nicely explains the idea that most rape victims never report the event.