Hillbillies and guns.

[pErvinalia]

That you choose not to, is evidence of the truth of my other made up claim...

[piscator]

He also chooses to think the socioeconomic status of American brown people is a veritable mirror of their "Entitlement mentality" - the result of years of Socialist vote pandering and massive monetary redistribution - and has nothing whatsoever to do with 250 years of American slavery, racism, and Jim Crow.

[Seth]

He also chooses to think the socioeconomic status of American brown people is a veritable mirror of their "Entitlement mentality" - the result of years of Socialist vote pandering and massive monetary redistribution - and has nothing whatsoever to do with 250 years of American slavery, racism, and Jim Crow.

Go fuck yourself.

Don't try to tell others what I think, I'll take care of that.

And you're entirely wrong. It has everything to do with the historical oppression of blacks in the US. What you fail to understand is that the welfare state and the driving of blacks and minorities into the dependent class, which is a specific agenda of the Marxists Progressives, is simply another form of slavery, racism and Jim Crow. That's what's so disgusting about it.

Welfare state proponents are not trying to help blacks, they are trying to enslave them and keep them from prospering by assuming that they are incapable of taking care of themselves if properly motivated to do so, so they set up an entitlement system and push blacks into the dependent class to "help" them because, of course, blacks are just naturally inferior and can't take care of themselves, so the "bleeding heart" liberals are compelled by their compassion and altruism to bind them ever more firmly into complete dependence on government largess.

Those "bleeding heart liberals" are the useful idiots of the Marxist Progressives who have a much more sinister ulterior motive, which is to bind blacks to "liberal" causes and coerce them into voting for Marxist Progressive programs by threatening their very ability to exist with specious and flatly false claims that if they don't vote for Obama, the evil conservatives will put up rolls of razor wire around the ghetto and watch them starve to death.

The purpose of the welfare state and the creation and expansion of the dependent class is not altruistic or charitable at all, it's cynically evil and immoral and it replaces physical and legal slavery with economic slavery through dependence on the Marxist Progressive government. It's nothing but a power play.

You, like many other ignorant people falsely assume that because conservatives and Libertarians revile the welfare state that this must mean that we hate the poor blacks and want to put them back on the plantation. That's just utter bullshit.

We believe that everyone has a right to flourish economically and socially, but that it cannot be achieved by a welfare state and a generationally inculcated dependency culture. We believe that blacks, given the proper motivation and opportunity to pull themselves out of poverty by their own efforts will gain not just economic prosperity and social status, but they will gain self-respect and will raise their children to be successful too because they are inherently equal in every respect to every other person and are just as capable of being economically successful and socially strong as anyone else, if given the opportunity and motivation to succeed. There are far too many highly successful blacks for anyone to argue anything to the contrary, and what binds the dependent class to dependency is exactly and precisely the efforts of useful idiots who secretly think themselves superior to the "poor blacks" and like to make themselves feel better by giving blacks largess, in the entirely mistaken notion that this helps blacks to rise out of poverty. It doesn't, it binds them into poverty by removing any motivation they might have to apply themselves, better themselves and prosper through their own innate worthiness and ability.

Giving people money because they are poor, but denying them the very impetus they need to better themselves so that they can break out of poverty comprises fetters of gold. This is true of every dependent class culture, irrespective of race. You see it in the UK, Ireland, Greece, France, Sweden, Denmark and literally everywhere else the "enlightened" middle and upper class allow their good judgment to be overwhelmed by arrogant and self-serving pity for the poor.

The poor don't need pity, and they don't need to be fettered to dependency generation after generation, they need to be taught and motivated to fend for themselves and their families so that they can do so without government largess. Does this mean that no poor person should ever receive assistance from the government? No, it does not. What it does mean is that any government largess must be conditioned on the active participation in improving their knowledge, skills and work ethic by the recipients. Only in this way does government largess work to free the poor from poverty by giving them the skills to raise themselves out of poverty by their own (assisted) efforts.

This is why Clinton's "Welfare to Work" system that limited lifetime welfare participation to five years was so very successful at moving the dependent class from dependency to self-sufficiency. Obama shut that down when he took office and put people back into the dependent class because he and his Marxist Progressive ilk NEED the dependent class to be dependent, because that's how they control the votes of the dependent class...by frightening them into thinking that without the Marxist Progressive government largess they will starve and die of curable diseases under conservative "rule."

It's all lies.

We want the best for the poor, but we understand that giving a man a fish feeds him for the day, and it binds him to the fishmonger forever, whereas teaching him to fish frees him forever and gives him the ability to not just care for himself and his family, but to prosper and become a profitable fish monger of his own.

That's how economies flourish...by giving people the skill and motivation they need to find their niche in the free market where they contribute their labor and skill to add value and create wealth in the system. Economies cannot even continue to exist for long if the dependent class produces nothing, consumes more and more, and the cost of supporting them is imposed on a smaller and smaller segment of the productive class. That's a simple economic fact that you socialists just cannot seem to comprehend.

This is nothing new. The Founders recognized this problem and Benjamin Franklin said it best:

"I am for doing good to the poor, but I differ in opinion of the means. I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. In my youth I traveled much, and I observed in different countries, that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer." - Relating to prices and the poor, 1766

"I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." - On the Price of Corn and Management of the Poor, November 29, 1766

[piscator]

American Conservatives have been consistently denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow for at least 250 years. Watch Bill Buckley reading from the same bullshit script as the post above, almost 50 years ago...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFeoS41xe7w&t=39m37s[/youtube]

[Seth]

American Conservatives have been consistently denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow for at least 250 years. Watch Bill Buckley reading from the same bullshit script as the post above, almost 50 years ago...

Lie.

What you fail to understand is that nobody's "denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow," particularly not conservatives. What we dispute are the appropriate and empowering solutions to the lingering effects. Fostering generational dependency on government is not, in many people's opinion, an acceptable way to eliminate these lingering effects. In point of fact the traditional welfare system we had for decades only made things worse and kept blacks mired in poverty and dependence while simultaneously destroying the family structure of black families through the byzantine rules of the welfare system that discouraged marriage and stable families and encouraged single-motherhood, lots of babies and no father-figure in the household by penalizing couples who stayed together and rewarding fecundity. Even those who are social and political leaders in the black community acknowledge this, which is precisely why Clinton reformed the welfare system, which produced the desired results until Obama, by illegal executive fiat, quit enforcing the work requirements for exactly the reasons I elucidated before.

Bill Buckley, and many others, have indeed been saying the same thing for decades, and they were correct to do so, just as I am today. It's flatly racist to think that blacks need to be cared for by the government. They don't. They need to be granted the same respect for their abilities as anyone else and they need to be expected to care for themselves and their families, just like anybody else. If they need assistance to overcome the initial hurdle of finding gainful employment, I'm all for helping them to accomplish that. But after that they have the same responsibilities for themselves and their children as anyone else does, and that does NOT happen to include an ongoing dependence on government largess.

[piscator]

American Conservatives have been consistently denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow for at least 250 years. Watch Bill Buckley reading from the same bullshit script as the post above, almost 50 years ago...

Lie.

What you fail to understand is that nobody's "denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow," particularly not conservatives.

Then you understand the still-present effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow, and feel a disproportionate percentage of brown people just have to starve in a ditch for their own motivational good?


If you watch the video I linked, you'll have a Bond Villain from 1965 making every sneering paternal argument declared in your shit-lipped confession of faith a couple posts back. Conservatives are still spitballing the same old Lester Maddox abstractions, which is why they're always on the defensive on matters of race in America.

[Seth]

American Conservatives have been consistently denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow for at least 250 years. Watch Bill Buckley reading from the same bullshit script as the post above, almost 50 years ago...

Lie.

What you fail to understand is that nobody's "denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow," particularly not conservatives.

Then you understand the still-present effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow, and feel a disproportionate percentage of brown people just have to starve in a ditch for their own motivational good?

Nobody starves in ditches in the US. There's plenty of charitable help available from non-governmental sources for those who are in need. Not so much for the lazy assholes who prefer to deal crack and pot and bang with their gangs rather than working. We should be so lucky as to have THEM starve in ditches.

If you watch the video I linked, you'll have a Bond Villain from 1965 making every sneering paternal argument declared in your shit-lipped confession of faith a couple posts back. Conservatives are still spitballing the same old Lester Maddox abstractions, which is why they're always on the defensive on matters of race in America.

Go fuck yourself.

[piscator]

American Conservatives have been consistently denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow for at least 250 years. Watch Bill Buckley reading from the same bullshit script as the post above, almost 50 years ago...

Lie.

What you fail to understand is that nobody's "denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow," particularly not conservatives.

Then you understand the still-present effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow, and feel a disproportionate percentage of brown people just have to starve in a ditch for their own motivational good?

Nobody starves in ditches in the US. There's plenty of charitable help available from non-governmental sources for those who are in need. Not so much for the lazy assholes who prefer to deal crack and pot and bang with their gangs rather than working. We should be so lucky as to have THEM starve in ditches.

No hillbilly meth dealers or welfare ranchers?

If you watch the video I linked, you'll have a Bond Villain from 1965 making every sneering paternal argument declared in your shit-lipped confession of faith a couple posts back. Conservatives are still spitballing the same old Lester Maddox abstractions, which is why they're always on the defensive on matters of race in America.

Go fuck yourself.

I'm not a Libertarian.

[Seth]

American Conservatives have been consistently denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow for at least 250 years. Watch Bill Buckley reading from the same bullshit script as the post above, almost 50 years ago...

Lie.

What you fail to understand is that nobody's "denying the effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow," particularly not conservatives.

Then you understand the still-present effects of slavery, racism, and Jim Crow, and feel a disproportionate percentage of brown people just have to starve in a ditch for their own motivational good?

Nobody starves in ditches in the US. There's plenty of charitable help available from non-governmental sources for those who are in need. Not so much for the lazy assholes who prefer to deal crack and pot and bang with their gangs rather than working. We should be so lucky as to have THEM starve in ditches.

No hillbilly meth dealers or welfare ranchers?

Nope, 'cause they got mad skillz.

If you watch the video I linked, you'll have a Bond Villain from 1965 making every sneering paternal argument declared in your shit-lipped confession of faith a couple posts back. Conservatives are still spitballing the same old Lester Maddox abstractions, which is why they're always on the defensive on matters of race in America.

Go fuck yourself.

I'm not a Libertarian. [/quote]

That should make it ridiculously easy for you to do then.

[piscator]

Nobody starves in ditches in the US. There's plenty of charitable help available from non-governmental sources for those who are in need. Not so much for the lazy assholes who prefer to deal crack and pot and bang with their gangs rather than working. We should be so lucky as to have THEM starve in ditches.

No hillbilly meth dealers or welfare ranchers?

Nope, 'cause they got mad skillz.

And they're white...

Go fuck yourself.

I'm not a Libertarian.

That should make it ridiculously easy for you to do then.

That reminds me...How's your mom?

[FBM]

Gentlemen, please restrict your attacks to ideas and not fellow members. Fanks.

[FBM]

5 mind-blowing facts nobody told you about guns.

Spoiler: They're Barbie dolls for men.

[piscator]

Anyone interested in hillbillies and guns would do well to consider hardscrabble club-wielding English Borderer frontier mores and tribal folkways, and how successful they were in the vast western frontiers of the New World.

The American Backcountry


The borderers entered America principally through the ports of Philadelphia and Newcastle. They moved quickly into the surrounding countryside, and in the words of one official, simply squatted wherever they found "a spot of vacant land." The Quakers were not happy about this invasion. "Our people are in pain," wrote Jonathan Dickinson in 1717, "From the north of Ireland many hundreds [have come]."27 The North Britons brought with them the ancient border habit of belligerence toward other ethnic groups. As early as 1730, Pennsylvania officials were complaining of their "audacious and disorderly manner." One of them wrote, "I must own from my own experience in the land office that the settlement of five families from Ireland gives me more trouble than fifty of any other people. Before we were now broke in upon, ancient Friends and first settlers lived happily; but now the case is quite altered."28

Among Quakers there was talk of restricting immigration as early as 1718, by "laying a Duty of 5 pounds a head on some sorts and double on others."29 But this idea cut against the grain of William Penn's holy experiment, and was not adopted. Instead, the Quakers decided to deal with the problem in a different way, by encouraging the borderers to settle in the "back parts" of the colony. In 1731, James Logan informed the Penns in England that he was deliberately planting the North Britons in the west, "as a frontier in case of any disturbance. " Logan argued that these people might usefully become a buffer population between the Indians and the Quakers. At the same time, he frankly hoped to rid the east of them.30

With much encouragement from Quaker leaders, the North Britons moved rapidly westward from Philadelphia into the rolling hills of the interior. Many drifted south and west along the mountains of Maryland, Virginia and the Carolinas. They gradually became the dominant English-speaking culture in a broad belt of territory that extended from the highlands of Appalachia through much of the Old Southwest. In the nineteenth century, they moved across the Mississippi River to Arkansas, Missouri, Oklahoma and Texas. By the twentieth century, their influence would be felt as far west as New Mexico, Arizona and southern California.

The area of their settlement may be observed in the first U.S. Census of 1790. The distribution of surnames shows that immigrants from North Britain found their way into every part of the American colonies. But by far the largest concentration was to be found in the backcountry region that included southwestern Pennsylvania, the western parts of Maryland and Virginia, North and South Carolina, Georgia, Kentucky and Tennessee.31

Throughout that broad area, more than half of the population came from Scotland, Ireland and northern England. Other ethnic minorities also moved into the backcountry, but their numbers remained comparatively small. The largest of the non English- speaking groups were the Germans, who swarmed into the west- central parts of Pennsylvania and Maryland, and also in the northern reaches of the Valley of Virginia. But altogether, the Germans made up only about 5 percent of the population in North and South Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee and Kentucky in 1790. They remained a very small minority in the southern highlands.

Other ethnic groups also included scattered settlements of French Huguenots, Swiss Protestants, Welsh Baptists, West Indians and even a colony of Greeks. But 90 percent of the backsettlers were either English, Irish or Scottish; and an actual majorit came from Ulster, the Scottish lowlands, and the north o England. North Britons were 73 to 80 percent of the population in Virginia's Augusta, Rockbridge, Fayette and Lincoln counties 75 percent in Pennsylvania's Washington County, 90 percent in some counties of Tennesses and Kentucky, nearly 100 percent in the Hillsboro district of North Carolina and a large majority in much of the South Carolina upcountry. These areas would become the seed settlements of the southern highlands.32

Numbers alone, however, were not the full measure of their dominion. These emigrants from North Britain established in the southern highlands a cultural hegemony that was even greater than their proportion in the population.33 An explanation of this fact may be found in the character of this American environment, which proved to be exceptionally well matched to the culture of the British borderlands.
...

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~UG97/albion/abackcou.html

[Seth]

No hillbilly meth dealers or welfare ranchers?

Nope, 'cause they got mad skillz.

And they're white...

Plenty of black, Hispanic and Asian hillbilly meth dealers and ranchers out there last time I checked.

Go fuck yourself.

I'm not a Libertarian.

That should make it ridiculously easy for you to do then.

That reminds me...How's your mom?

Still dead last I heard. How's your prick smell? Must be hard to get the taste of rotting corpse out of your mouth as well...

[piscator]