BBC - Blitz: The Bombing of Coventry

[klr]

This was broadcast last night on BBC2. One of the best documentaries I've seen in ages.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00n7xky

Those of you who can access the iPlayer archive can view the program for another 6 days. Wait for it to appear elsewhere as well.

On 14th November 1940, the Luftwaffe launched the most devastating bombing raid so far on Britain. The target was Coventry, deep in the heart of England.

In a 12-hour blitz, the Luftwaffe dropped thousands of tons of bombs. Three-quarters of the city centre was devastated, including the ancient cathedral. The Nazis coined a phrase - 'to Coventrate' - to describe the intense destruction.

It was a baptism of fire for Coventry and Britain. For years, the government feared that aerial bombardment could destroy civilian morale. In Coventry, those fears were tested, and in the immediate aftermath of the blitz the evidence was not encouraging. Panic and hysteria gripped the city, and half of Coventry's population fled. However, within weeks - and contrary to all expectations - the city revived. Factories were soon turning out aircraft parts which would be used to avenge the attack on Coventry.

The RAF studied the Nazi bombing techniques and perfected the art of 'Coventration'. In Dresden, Hamburg and Berlin, the Nazis reaped the whirlwind they had sown in their devastating attack.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Goering said he could bomb them into submission. He failed. WSC said the British people would "never give up, never give up, never give up!"
"Bomber Harris" said he could bomb them into submission. He boldly ignored the example of his own country.

[klr]

Goering said he could bomb them into submission. He failed. WSC said the British people would "never give up, never give up, never give up!"
"Bomber Harris" said he could bomb them into submission. He boldly ignored the example of his own country.

That angle is discussed, at least on the British side. The British government greatly feared a collapse in morale, but the people of Coventry recovered very quickly and became defiant instead.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Goering said he could bomb them into submission. He failed. WSC said the British people would "never give up, never give up, never give up!"
"Bomber Harris" said he could bomb them into submission. He boldly ignored the example of his own country.

That angle is discussed, at least on the British side. The British government greatly feared a collapse in morale, but the people of Coventry recovered very quickly and became defiant instead.

That's as far as that argument seems to get. The bombing of Dresden was, IIRC, meant to be a morale killer. I think it's a matter of war racismTM, "we could take it, but they won't be able to."

[klr]

Goering said he could bomb them into submission. He failed. WSC said the British people would "never give up, never give up, never give up!"
"Bomber Harris" said he could bomb them into submission. He boldly ignored the example of his own country.

That angle is discussed, at least on the British side. The British government greatly feared a collapse in morale, but the people of Coventry recovered very quickly and became defiant instead.

That's as far as that argument seems to get. The bombing of Dresden was, IIRC, meant to be a morale killer. I think it's a matter of war racismTM, "we could take it, but they won't be able to."

Dresden is a bit more complex than that IIRC, not least because of when it took place, and also the fact that the Soviets were advancing towards it.

German civilian morale held up very well overall, but the sustained and prolonged nature of the allied bombing eventually wore people down. What was Goering's comment? "The [German] people are bearing these raids like a chastisement from God".

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Goering said he could bomb them into submission. He failed. WSC said the British people would "never give up, never give up, never give up!"
"Bomber Harris" said he could bomb them into submission. He boldly ignored the example of his own country.

That angle is discussed, at least on the British side. The British government greatly feared a collapse in morale, but the people of Coventry recovered very quickly and became defiant instead.

That's as far as that argument seems to get. The bombing of Dresden was, IIRC, meant to be a morale killer. I think it's a matter of war racismTM, "we could take it, but they won't be able to."

Dresden is a bit more complex than that IIRC, not least because of when it took place, and also the fact that the Soviets were advancing towards it.

German civilian morale held up very well overall, but the sustained and prolonged nature of the allied bombing eventually wore people down. What was Goering's comment? "The [German] people are bearing these raids like a chastisement from God".

My point was that they didn't fold. Despite being "bombed back to the Stone Age." (Which was ridiculous anyway, Mick Jagger wasn't even two years old at the time.)

[klr]

Goering said he could bomb them into submission. He failed. WSC said the British people would "never give up, never give up, never give up!"
"Bomber Harris" said he could bomb them into submission. He boldly ignored the example of his own country.

That angle is discussed, at least on the British side. The British government greatly feared a collapse in morale, but the people of Coventry recovered very quickly and became defiant instead.

That's as far as that argument seems to get. The bombing of Dresden was, IIRC, meant to be a morale killer. I think it's a matter of war racismTM, "we could take it, but they won't be able to."

Dresden is a bit more complex than that IIRC, not least because of when it took place, and also the fact that the Soviets were advancing towards it.

German civilian morale held up very well overall, but the sustained and prolonged nature of the allied bombing eventually wore people down. What was Goering's comment? "The [German] people are bearing these raids like a chastisement from God".

My point was that they didn't fold. Despite being "bombed back to the Stone Age." (Which was ridiculous anyway, Mick Jagger wasn't even two years old at the time.)

They didn't, but I suspect it played no small part in them not wanting to ever start a war again.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

They didn't, but I suspect it played no small part in them not wanting to ever start a war again.

I think it may be a part of that, and Der Frage being another part.

[Clinton Huxley]

I think the lesson still hasn't been learned, plenty of influential military types who think wars can be won from the sky alone.

Apropos of nothing, Granpa Huxley was a Bomb Aimer in Lancasters during the war. Didn't talk about it much though.

[FBM]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00n7xky

"This content doesn't seem to be working. Please try again."

Fucking continents/nationalities/languages/filters/servers/electrons...

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I think the lesson still hasn't been learned, plenty of influential military types who think wars can be won from the sky alone.

Apropos of nothing, Granpa Huxley was a Bomb Aimer in Lancasters during the war. Didn't talk about it much though.

"Bomb aimer" is an oxymoron.

BTW, my lead prof. used to cite statistics stating that most bombs didn't come within five miles of their target. I did some digging and found that this info stemmed from a Jan. 1941 RAF report, and that the report led to measures to improve that. I guess profs can be just as good at quote mining as fundies.

[Clinton Huxley]

I think the lesson still hasn't been learned, plenty of influential military types who think wars can be won from the sky alone.

Apropos of nothing, Granpa Huxley was a Bomb Aimer in Lancasters during the war. Didn't talk about it much though.

"Bomb aimer" is an oxymoron.

BTW, my lead prof. used to cite statistics stating that most bombs didn't come within five miles of their target. I did some digging and found that this info stemmed from a Jan. 1941 RAF report, and that the report led to measures to improve that. I guess profs can be just as good at quote mining as fundies.

Well, I guess he confirmed the aircraft was over a country other than blighty before they opened the bomb-bay doors....

[klr]

I think the lesson still hasn't been learned, plenty of influential military types who think wars can be won from the sky alone.

Apropos of nothing, Granpa Huxley was a Bomb Aimer in Lancasters during the war. Didn't talk about it much though.

"Bomb aimer" is an oxymoron.

BTW, my lead prof. used to cite statistics stating that most bombs didn't come within five miles of their target. I did some digging and found that this info stemmed from a Jan. 1941 RAF report, and that the report led to measures to improve that. I guess profs can be just as good at quote mining as fundies.

No shit. Did the good professor ever explain how the likes of Hamburg, Darmstadt, Pforzheim and Dresden were incinerated?

Don't you just love academics with an agenda.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I think the lesson still hasn't been learned, plenty of influential military types who think wars can be won from the sky alone.

Apropos of nothing, Granpa Huxley was a Bomb Aimer in Lancasters during the war. Didn't talk about it much though.

"Bomb aimer" is an oxymoron.

BTW, my lead prof. used to cite statistics stating that most bombs didn't come within five miles of their target. I did some digging and found that this info stemmed from a Jan. 1941 RAF report, and that the report led to measures to improve that. I guess profs can be just as good at quote mining as fundies.

Well, I guess he confirmed the aircraft was over a country other than blighty before they opened the bomb-bay doors....

The report included 'aborts', where the plane dumped it's load in the Channel. The raw data was pretty 'orrible, and totally misleading.

[klr]

I think the lesson still hasn't been learned, plenty of influential military types who think wars can be won from the sky alone.

Apropos of nothing, Granpa Huxley was a Bomb Aimer in Lancasters during the war. Didn't talk about it much though.

"Bomb aimer" is an oxymoron.

BTW, my lead prof. used to cite statistics stating that most bombs didn't come within five miles of their target. I did some digging and found that this info stemmed from a Jan. 1941 RAF report, and that the report led to measures to improve that. I guess profs can be just as good at quote mining as fundies.

Well, I guess he confirmed the aircraft was over a country other than blighty before they opened the bomb-bay doors....

The report included 'aborts', where the plane dumped it's load in the Channel. The raw data was pretty 'orrible, and totally misleading.

The statistician in me is not amused. :twisted: